Graflex.org

peegeenyc · Joined: 15 Jan 2004 Posts: 20

hi all,

I'm wanting to use a graphic / crown graphic /super speed graphic for handheld rangefinder 4x5" work - what is the best model to look out for this? is the super speed graphic the latest and best?
or should I just get a good side mounted crown graphic with adjustable kalart finder?

(I don't need a backb shutter, and weight saving is alwasy good)

should I go for a top or side rangefinder? remembering I will probably want to put a modern 150mm lens on it, and adjust the rangfinder (or get a cam) for that.

and lastly, is the the focuspot device only for the side rangefinder? has anyone use one and does it work ok? it might be useful for me.

thanks, paul

t.r.sanford · Posted: Sat Apr 17, 2004 9:24 pm Post subject:

If you propose to work with one lens, a "Crown" with Kalart side-mounted rangefinder may be the most economical and straightforward choice. The Kalart rangefinder can be adjusted (within certain limits) and does not need a cam. The cams for the top-RF models are a bit hard to come by.

The "Focuspot" is a useful accessory, but it needs an external power supply -- usually, a two- or three-cell flashgun clipped to a bracket on the rangefinder housing. If you're looking to save weight, this is not a particularly attractive proposition.

You probably could make a small battery-box holding a couple of size AA or AAA cells, and attach it to the tripod socket, or something. The "Focuspot" has its own switch, so the wiring would be uncomplicated.

The top-RF "Crown" has a built-in equivalent to the "Focuspot," which Graflex called a "Rangelite." It is powered by size AA cells held in a battery-box inside the rangefinder/viewfinder shell. The top-RF "Crown" also offers automatic parallax correction.

I haven't used a "Super Graphic," so I can't testify to its serviceability in the field. Its rangefinder seems to have been an improvement over the "Pacemaker" RF, and it has a rotating back. It also has internal wiring for an electromagnetic shutter release, and this can add complexity. The lensboards are rather scarce and, when found, seem to command a premium price.

45PSS · Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 5:18 am Post subject:

The Crown top rf cam will come out from under the follower arm if camera is focused closer than 4 to 6 feet (depending on lens/cam comb) resulting in having to remove the cam to return to infinity focus or to close the camera.
The Super's do not have this problem.
A special Super lens board is only necessary IF you wish to use its battery/built in selonid to trip the shutter otherwise a Pacemaker board will fit.
The Super's have more front movements than a Crown if you plan to use a tripod and movement is important.
The 360⁰ rotating back is nice.
I did a 7 mile walk along the bay the other day with my super speed and two loaded grafmatics, the weight was not a problem.

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troublemaker · Joined: 24 Nov 2003 Posts: 715 Location: So Cal

I really like my Crown top RF, and the night spot needs only two AA's and is self contained under the RF cover on "top". It works as accurately as the RF is adjusted, perhaps better becuse my eyes are blurry looking through an RF. Point and shoot in the dark. Unfortunatley, I have yet to find one of the cams I want (p13) for a 162 lens, but the one that came with it works well for the stock 135.
If you are looking at Tops, ask if the lightspot works and if the battery door is present. The door falls out without the batteries in place, and many of them are lost. Mid west has replacements but pricey. I am not sure what Charles means when he says the cam follower falls out at less than 4-6ft on the topRF? Mine has never done anything like that and I have racked it out many times. Clarification?
Regardless, based on the necessity you will probably face in attaining the proper RF adjustment, you will have to decide between calibrating a side RF one time and using an external focuspot and power source, or trying to find the right cam for the Top or Super. You can make cams. I suggest reading on the sight here about both making cams, and adjusting side Kalarts. I have seen cams on auction, but not for a while. The last was a set for a Super I think, and sold for too much.
regards,
Stephen

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[ This Message was edited by: troublemaker on 2004-04-17 23:49 ]

worldphoto · Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:36 pm Post subject:

I second Stephen's comments regarding the Crown top RF. The manual for that camera is free on either my web site or Rich's web site.
Harry

glennfromwy · Joined: 29 Nov 2001 Posts: 903 Location: S.W. Wyoming

This is just my personal opinion, so don't yell at me. I consider the top rangefinder to be an unreliable bothersome piece of junk. I think, for reliability and overall ease of use, the Kalart side mounted rangefinder is the best option. I don't know much about using the focuspot, as I don't shoot in the dark. Can't stay awake that long. I see no reason why it shouldn't work just fine. Being the age I am, I remember how dim those old flashlight bulbs were, though, and if I were to use it, I think I would consider trying to re-fit it with a more modern, brighter bulb. If you can find a nice top finder Crown and have trouble with it or don't like that rangefinder, the ones I have and have seen have the shaft hole in place for a Kalart. Just remove the top finder, sell it on ebay, and install a good one.

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"Wyoming - Where everybody is somebody else's weirdo"

troublemaker · Joined: 24 Nov 2003 Posts: 715 Location: So Cal

I have four 2x3's with side Kalarts. They are a pain in the caboose to calibrate properly requiring a three step process of trial and repeat, but not necesarrily hard for the mechanically inclined (and somewhat fun). The Top on the other hand only requires that a spring be held back and drop in the cam which enables one to quickly change lens and RF settings in less than a minute as opposed to an hour plus. The advantage of the side mount will be that one can adjust it for the required focal length, and since we are talking about using just one lens, the side is definately a proven instrument. It is nice to have the mirror and prism in good condition. That was one reason I opted to get a newer crown, and my top works as well as my best side mount. The old flashlight bulb isn't great for the spot as noted by Glenn, but if I used it, I would retrofit a modern halogen bulb, otherwise I keep it original. But do note, my experience is lilmited, and there are two negative comments thus far regarding the Top RF from users with more expereince than I posses...
regards,
Stephen

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disemjg · Joined: 10 Jan 2002 Posts: 474 Location: Washington, DC

I've not had any trouble with my top RF cameras; they seem to work as well or better than my Kalarts. I suspect that the overall age and condition of a given body is really what is going to determine if problems are encountered. I have gone over all of mine to ensure function.

I have not used the Rangelite function. I just put a small wooden block in the battery compartment to hold the door in place. This is how the factory shipped them.

While I like both the top and side RFs, finding cams is a serious issue. If the camera is only going to be used with one lens, then a body with a Kalart should be selected, and the lens carefully matched. If the Kalart unit is in good condition it will work well.

45PSS · Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2004 3:42 am Post subject:

troublemaker,
Open the cam door on your camera and observe the lever (follower arm) that rides on the sloped side of the cam. It operates the moveable mirror in the RF. As you move the focus to full bellows extension (4 foot focus or so) does the cam come out from under the arm completely? NO? What is blocking it? If yes what prevents the arm from touching the slot that the cam goes into? Someone may have modified it to stop. If it touches the slot is the cam you have steep enough to pickup the arm instead of jaming against it?
Charles

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[ This Message was edited by: 45PSS on 2004-04-18 20:44 ]

troublemaker · Joined: 24 Nov 2003 Posts: 715 Location: So Cal

Hey Charles,
I checked out the cam opperation and it appears that nothing has been altered, and the cam stops just before the follower would fall off of it. I would assume it was designed this way as it would then fit Frommy's explitives, and I would have some of my own to add. I believe, and I can check when I have more time, that the cable, or part of the actuating device have a built in stop somewhere to prevent what you are describing. The contact down on the rail just stays behind at a certain point as it is racked out beyond the minimum focus distance allowed by the RF, similar to the side Kalart wherein the arm just stops travelling out after about the 4ft limit.
I have had the cam in and out a few times and really like the system, except for the idea that littel parts that come off tend to disappear over the years. If I had the proper drawings or dimensions I could make them easily. And may very well attempt the p13 by trial and error soon.
regards,
stephen

[ This Message was edited by: troublemaker on 2004-04-18 22:04 ]

peegeenyc · Joined: 15 Jan 2004 Posts: 20

thanks for all the help guys.

I guess I will get whatever comes up that is really nice condition - a super or crown or a really good side RF. I do work in low light often so an accurate RF with light could be useful.

I read about making cams and it sounds just a little out of my reach. that bit about a few thousands of an inch difference...

Meanwhile - if anyone has a super well sorted-out and calibrated RF theya re thinking of letting go, then please get in touch. It will be cared for well!

paul
peegeenyc@earthlink.net

t.r.sanford · Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 6:14 pm Post subject:

Graflex had such a long "life cycle" because it knew how to make functional, durable cameras. It seems to me that the simplest and most cost-effective way to get started would be with a side-RF "Crown" -- unless you can find a top-RF model, or a "Super," that is fitted with the lens you want to use.

If you shop carefully, I don't think you'll regret becoming involved with the "Graphic" line. The "Graphics" went out of production because all the art directors in the late '60s wanted Candid, Spontaneous, Dynamic 35mm. color transparencies -- not because there was anything wrong with the design!