Graflex.org

cp ste. croix · Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 5 Location: Vancouver BC Canada

Hi all, I'm new here, having been pointed this way from another forum.

I just got a Crown graphic, and though I've yet to get my film in the mail, I've been fooling around with it.

My question is this, when focusing, the rf looks to be in agreement with the distance scale on the side, but the image on the gg is always really soft. In fact, I can't get the gg to look sharp for anything other than really close up shots (about 6-12 inches). Should I just wait and see what a polaroid looks like focussed with the rf and gg respectively, or should I prepare myself for major repairs?

Thanks for any and all help,

Chris

RichS · Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 5:54 am Post subject:

The rangefinder is just a simple split image created by two mirrors, one of which moves. It won't give you a lcue as to what will wind up on the film.

The GG on the other hand is pretty much what you will get on the film.

For any help, you could supply a bit more info. Is this your first LF camera? What kind of lens is on it? Are you using a loupe to focus on the GG?

Unless there's something terribly wrong with the lens, a sharp image should be possible on the GG at some point. The softness may just be your not being used to GG focusing? It could be a bad GG. It could be a bad lens?

If you say it's sharp at 6-12 inches, then it should be sharp at any other distance. Now, 6-12 inches is awfully close to focus a Crown. My first thought is that you have the lens too far out on the rails and therefore can't really focus any further away. Does the camera have infinity stops? The lens should be roughly the same distance from the film plane as the focal length of the lens. So if it a 135mm lens, the distance from the film plane to the lens board should be roughly 135mm. If you're going much further out than that, you'll only be able to focus on close objects.

Give us a little more info. And using Polaroid is a great way to check the camera and have fun with it.

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alecj · Joined: 09 May 2001 Posts: 853 Location: Alabama

Chris: It's probably a silly question, but to eliminate the obvious you ARE pulling the lens standard out to the infinity stops on the bed, aren't you?

And, I suppose it's possible the lens was changed from the time when the rangefinder/distance scale were aligned.

[ This Message was edited by: alecj on 2006-02-09 06:09 ]

Rangemaster · Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 4:36 pm Post subject:

You don't say, what type of lens you have. You should be able to attain sharp focus on the ground glass, if as has been said, you are pulling the standard out and making sure it is set correctly. Make sure when you pull the front standard out, that you move to the infinity stopps on the rail, then try to focus on different things at different distances.

Dave

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cp ste. croix · Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 5 Location: Vancouver BC Canada

Hi guys,

I'm at work now, but I remember that the lens is a 135 f 4.7...this is my first LF camera and I can't tell you how long it took me to figure out how to even open the thing

The infinity stops are those little tabs to keep the bellows extended? If so, then I am locking them down after I pull the lens out... It is entirely possible that I am just unused to focussing a GG image, and no, I'm not using a loupe, though I will try that when I get home from work.

Thanks for your help, and I'll update this when I get home.

chris

ps...i am super excited to start using this badboy! This is a great site you have here, I am really happy I was pointed this way.

alecj · Joined: 09 May 2001 Posts: 853 Location: Alabama

"I am locking them down after I pull the lens out.."

Well, that's a start. Before you pull the lens standard out, be sure the infinity STOPS (yes, that's what they're called) are UP, not down. Then unlock the standard (if it was locked when you last closed the camera) and pull it out until it STOPS against the stops.

Once the lens standard is locked in that position, it isn't moved again. You focus with the front knobs.

After that, see what your ground glass shows vis-a-vis the rangefinder and distance scale.

cp ste. croix · Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 5 Location: Vancouver BC Canada

troublemaker · Joined: 24 Nov 2003 Posts: 715 Location: So Cal

Chris,
It is possible to do some damge to these cameras to the little back rails and or the cable reales running under the bellows if not closed correctly. Never force it closed if it will not easily snap shut.
Correct procedure is to roll the focaus rails all the way back, then run the front standard back as far as it will go and lock it down back inside the body. the camera should then close easily and snap shut.
Did you resolve if the infinity stops were positioned correctly for your lens.
You can also set the camera on a tripod, and with the rails 1/16" forwardof the frathest rear position, run the front standard out until reaching sharp focus and lock down. It should be at the infinity stops, but some people have set them at the rear most position. If not right on at either someone switchedout the lens or put this one back on without recalibrating the RF. Some RF's also break at the prism and or gunk up etc. Not the end of the world and easily enough repaired later on after you figure out some of this other stuff.... Also I have found folks often getthe Ground Glass and fresnel incorrectly mounted and there is lots of info on that here too. (Ground side of glass towards lens, smooth side of fresnel also towrds lens so that both rough sides of the focussing screens face each other. Remove and clean bothe sides of each with soft cloth and windex and all will be good).
But hopefully you just need to learn to use the camera. Check around on line and see if you can find a Speed Graphic user manual. Rich might have one at his site, or it might be a repair manual I don't remeber which he has.

cp ste. croix · Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 5 Location: Vancouver BC Canada

It was only that I needed to figure out how to use the camera properly. Now that i've got focussing down, my next hurdle is the film loading

Have any of you used the camera with bellows past the infinity stops for close-up/portraiture? It looks like it might be a pain but provide pleasing results.

RichS · Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 6:24 am Post subject:

Never feel bad about asking questions here. Except fomr some folks like maybe Les and Bert, I don't think any of us were born with complete Graflex knowledge

And don't worry about racking out your bellows either. In the standard position against the infinity stops, you should be able to focus down to a few feet or closer. If you need to get close, fold down the stops and move the front standard out on the rails.

For close-ups or when using a lens like the 15 inch tele, it is common to have the bellows tretched as far as they will go. As long as yours are in decent shape, it won't hurt anything.

One thing to remember though. As a general rule, the further away from the film you take the lens, the more camera shake will affect the picture quality. So if you rack it all the way out for a close-up, make sure it's on a good solit tripod. And use a cable release. And before you trigger the shutter, let the camera settle down after pulling the dark slide and such...

Most of the fun is in the learning and practice, and there's always something new to learn...

Enjoy!

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"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"

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alecj · Joined: 09 May 2001 Posts: 853 Location: Alabama

Rich covered the physical aspects of the extended bellows. I wanted to remind you that if you choose to attempt some photography using that ability, do some prior research on the proper calculation of exposure before you waste film. Extra exposure time/lens opening settings will be necessary with the extended bellows. There are formulas which assist in that calculation. Enjoy your camera.

RichS · Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:02 am Post subject:

Okay, a shameless plug

Check my site:
http://www.southbristolviews.com
for a couple of menu items on close-up shooting. there's some ecplantion of the math and a printable 'calculator' for bellows extension. It's the marker/ruler type and works quite well.

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"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"

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cp ste. croix · Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 5 Location: Vancouver BC Canada

Thanks for the info...I most assuredly would have gone off shooting blindly adhering to my meter.

It seems that the exposures might be a litte long for portraiture, but it never hurts to try!

Is there a place here where users post images? I'd love to see/share some!

Dan Fromm · Joined: 14 May 2001 Posts: 2144 Location: New Jersey

RichS · Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 4:42 am Post subject:

Dan is of course right. For any normal [portrait work, you wouldn't have to worry about bellows extension and exposure compensation. I never give it a thought unless I'm getting within one or two feet of the subject. Usually by "close-up" we're talking inches from the lens. This requires quite a bit of compensation.

If you're shooting at greater than three feet from the camera, just go with your meter reading. If you're shooting transparencies, you might get a little more sticky with exposure but I doubt it...

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"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"

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