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105mm Nikkor on Mini Crown Graphic?
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Negative Energy



Joined: 14 Sep 2005
Posts: 17
Location: Philadelphia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 11:32 am    Post subject: 105mm Nikkor on Mini Crown Graphic? Reply with quote

I'm seriously considering this combo, but I'd really like to shoot handheld. The camera cams were made for a 101mm Ektar. Will the 4mm difference throw things off? Should I (can I?) get a custom made cam so the RF works properly?

RA Friedman
Philadelphia
http://rafriedman.com
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Dan Fromm



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 1863
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RA, the 2x3 Crown has a Kalart rangefinder. There are no cams, the RF is adjusted to a lens by changing the effective lengths of a some internal linkages after it is set up for infinity focus. There are instructions for adjusting a Kalart on this site, look for them.

Ain't no way a Kalart set up for one focal length will give good focus for another. Also, no two lenses of the same nominal focal length have quite the same actual focal length. So if you replace, say, one 101/4.5 Ektar with another, you'll have to adjust the RF for the replacement lens.
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Negative Energy



Joined: 14 Sep 2005
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Location: Philadelphia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 2:20 pm    Post subject: Re: 105 Nikkor Reply with quote

That's great news. Thanks for the info. Only plan on using one lens.
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Dan Fromm



Joined: 14 May 2001
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the way, its occurred to me to wonder what you meant by "mini Crown Graphic." Graflex Inc's use of words, also that of predecessors and successors, is extremely confusing.

"Mini Graphic" usually means Miniature Speed Graphic, more or less the first 2x3 version of the Speed Graphic. Has a focal plane shutter, was made from 1937 (may be wrong, am working from memory) to 1946.

Crown Graphic means what it says, a wooden-bodied press camera with no focal plane shutter made from 1947-1972. Came in three sizes: 2x3, 3x4, 4x5.

And then there was the 2x3 Pacemaker Speed Graphic, made from 1947 to sometime in the early '60s. Has a focal plane shutter. Sometimes called Mini Speed by people who aren't fluent in Graflex-talk.

So, which one are you contemplating buying?
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Negative Energy



Joined: 14 Sep 2005
Posts: 17
Location: Philadelphia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 10:35 pm    Post subject: Re: 105mm Nikkor Reply with quote

I have the camera already and I've never been sure of the correct nomenclature. It's a 2x3 Crown Graphic with a Graflok back and a 101mm f4.5 coated Ektar. RF is on the side.
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Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The company name for the camera was the "Pacemaker 23 Crown Graphic"
(which is why nobody uses the proper name)
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"In order to invent, you need a good imagination and a lot of junk" Thomas Edison
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Negative Energy



Joined: 14 Sep 2005
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Location: Philadelphia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:18 am    Post subject: Re: Pacemaker 23 Crown Graphic Reply with quote

Thanks for the info. !

So, the questionis will the 105 or 100 Nikkor lens and shutter fit. Will I be able to close the bed of the camera? Will I need a new lensboard?
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Dan Fromm



Joined: 14 May 2001
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes.

I don't know.

Depends. If you have a lens on board (not clear from your post) and the hole in the board is no larger than a #0's mounting hole (I think that's what the Nikkor is in, check at www.skgrimes.com for shutter specs) the existing hole can be enlarged as needed to accept a #0. If the hole's larger than needed, its time for a new board with a brand new hole. And if you want to continue to use the new lens, its time for a new board too.
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troublemaker



Joined: 24 Nov 2003
Posts: 715
Location: So Cal

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes it is a Copal #0. The camera should close. I just placed my Copal #0 shutter in one of my Crowns and when I turned the shutter so that the large Copal cocking lever is at the top left it just clears the focussing track when closing. Though my Copal is an earlier model, I believe the dimensions and cocking lever are unchanged with the later black versions like the Nikkor will be mounted in. I can't gaurantee it, but I have had a Nikkor 105 in my hands once and IIRC I'm going to say yes it will. The cocking lever is the only issue; it is otherwise a small shutter. The bigger Compur #1 for the Xenotar 2.8 is actually a tighter fit, and these are regularly found on Century Graphics.
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Negative Energy



Joined: 14 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the info.

RA
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C. Henry



Joined: 13 Dec 2005
Posts: 356
Location: North East Georgia, USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I don't know that the terminology was ever "factory approved" I have heard the 2 x 3 Pacemakers called the "Baby Speed Graphic" and "Baby Crown Graphic" for at least a half a century. Probably to distinguish them from the earlier factory designated "Miniature Speed Graphic".

C. Henry
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Dan Fromm



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

C. Henry, your observations are absolutely correct. Thing is, the common language is imprecise. One person's Mini Speed is another's Baby Speed is another's 2x3 Pacemaker Speed, and so on. Because of the lack of precision, the names alone aren't safe to act on.

On an apparently unrelated topic, a while ago I bought a set of 32 Mexican cookbooks; there's one for each of the 31 states and another for Mexico City. Their titles have the form Home Cooking in the State of X. The set contains more than 2,700 recipes.

I've found numerous examples in the set of a name used many times for very different recipes and of the same recipe having different names. That's the common language for you.

Cheers,

Dan

Folk ichthyology is every bit as trustworthy. In one of his books on US fishes, the great David Starr Jordan reported more than 200 common names for the Large Mouth Black Bass, including Trout and Chub.
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Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan Fromm wrote:
C. Henry, your observations are absolutely correct. Thing is, the common language is imprecise. One person's Mini Speed is another's Baby Speed is another's 2x3 Pacemaker Speed, and so on. Because of the lack of precision, the names alone aren't safe to act on.
Cheers,
Dan


Then there's the guy that insisted he had a "baby Speed Graphic" *******..until I showed him the word "Century" on the camera.

And from what I hear, Franke & Heidke never officially made a "Baby Rollei" either.
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troublemaker



Joined: 24 Nov 2003
Posts: 715
Location: So Cal

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think I was incorrectly calling my first Pacmaker 23 Speed Graphic as a Mini-Speed right after I got it. What a completely different model than the pre-Pacemaker Mini-Speed I now have and enjoy using. Easy to do though, since the small Pacemakers are pretty much mini versions of the Tiger tank 4x5's.
But at least I never got the Century mixed up with the wooden models.
As for the Baby Rollei... If you are refering to the 127 film model, I wonder how many folks get those off the auction site thinking they are getting a 120 camera?
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jan normandale



Joined: 13 Nov 2007
Posts: 30
Location: Toronto Canada

PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan Fromm wrote:
On an apparently unrelated topic, a while ago I bought a set of 32 Mexican cookbooks; there's one for each of the 31 states and another for Mexico City. Their titles have the form Home Cooking in the State of X. The set contains more than 2,700 recipes.

I've found numerous examples in the set of a name used many times for very different recipes and of the same recipe having different names. That's the common language for you.

Cheers,

Dan

Folk ichthyology is every bit as trustworthy. In one of his books on US fishes, the great David Starr Jordan reported more than 200 common names for the Large Mouth Black Bass, including Trout and Chub.


Dan OT.. do you fish and cook... just curious. I'm surprised to see you know of Starr Jordan's book and also regional Mexican cookery. You can pm me if you wish to respond. cheers Jan
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