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Photographic doldrums
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Nick



Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I made a 4x5 negative carrier out of matt board. I doubt it would work for 8x10 for various reasons but I can't see why you couldn't just use two sheets of glass.
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RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only film carrier I ever made was for 16mm and Minox for my 35mm enlarger. I think I used some flavor of cardboard

4x5 seems to work well glassless, but 8x10 is a bit larger. I would doubt it would hold flat even vertically (in a horizontal enlarger). Glass should work fine even if only beneath it to hold it flat. And optical glass is available if not overly cheap. In the horizontal design, two sheets of glass would probably be need though because the film could sag in either direction.

I haven't looked into it yet, but I had a thought of cutting the divider out of an old film holder to make a negative carrier? Not well suited to glass, but already designed to hold the film...

Now I'm just thinking of making the light box with a foam material around the front (open) end. Use any standard 8x10 camera, leave the GG in place and just slide in the modified film holder with negative. Then slide the light box up against the back of the camera with the foam as a light seal. If it's all mounted on some sort of table, it might work?


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Nick



Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2003-10-21 12:57, RichS wrote:


I haven't looked into it yet, but I had a thought of cutting the divider out of an old film holder to make a negative carrier? Not well suited to glass, but already designed to hold the film...

Now I'm just thinking of making the light box with a foam material around the front (open) end. Use any standard 8x10 camera, leave the GG in place and just slide in the modified film holder with negative. Then slide the light box up against the back of the camera with the foam as a light seal. If it's all mounted on some sort of table, it might work?




An old plate holder? Should be able to put some glass in there.

The problem I see is heat. You'll need some sort of fan setup.
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clnfrd



Joined: 26 Mar 2002
Posts: 616
Location: Western Kentucky Lakes Area

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't know how large you want to enlarge, but if you are going to make 16X20's, that's only doubling the size of the neg. That doesn't require a super-bright light source. My old Kodak cold-light enlarger has a circular fluorescent light...lamps easily obtained...in a housing painted with flat white paint. There's no condenser...no diffuser...and I don't see any hot spots. I think I would toy around with fluorescent...though dim...but cool. Fred.
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clnfrd



Joined: 26 Mar 2002
Posts: 616
Location: Western Kentucky Lakes Area

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, enlarging an 8X10 to 16X20 ian't doubling it...it's quadrupling (4X) the area.
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Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2003 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fred,
You were right the first time.

16 divide by 8 = 2.

If I gave my graphics house an 8x10 and asked them to shoot it at 200% I'd get back a 16x20. Of course my graphics house closed down this year along with the last two labs that processed any sheet film but that's another story.

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RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2003 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2003-10-21 16:15, clnfrd wrote:
Okay, enlarging an 8X10 to 16X20 ian't doubling it...it's quadrupling (4X) the area.

Close enough Fred

Fluorescent light would be the best, but there's always a concern for the color. It may look white, but what about VC papers? I won't even bring up color work mostly because I haven't done it in too many years and have little interest in going back. Testing a general flourescent bulb would be pretty easy though.

Considering an 8x10 enlarger, we could easily use 12 inch bulbs set parallel to each other. With a shuttered lens, this would be easy since flourescent lights would have to be left on. Another opton would be the screw-in replacement bulbs they sell for household lamps. Four packs of them are pretty cheap, they don't take up much more space than a standard light bulb and 4 or 5 could still be used in the box for additional light.

That enlarger you have has nothing between the bulb and the negative and it has even illumination? What shape is the bulb?


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clnfrd



Joined: 26 Mar 2002
Posts: 616
Location: Western Kentucky Lakes Area

PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2003 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Kodak Enlarger I have has a circular lamp, readily available at Wal*mart, in white or daylight. The housing is also circular and is formed so that the lamp is actually recessed around the outer edge so that the illumination is reflected off the white painted interior. Nothing between that reflective surface and the negative carrier. It is a Hobbyist 2-1/4"X3-1/4" enlarger...a cheap version of the more pricey Kodak Fluorite Enlarger that featured Ektar interchangeable lenses. My version has an Ektanon lens. This lamp assembly would be too small for 8X10. I think they may make larger circular lamps. If you double an 8X10, 80 sq. inches, you get 16X10, 160 sq, inches. A 16X20 is 320 sq. inches, four times the size of an 8X10. Fred. P.S. Here's a site re fluorescent circular lamps: http://www.lighting.philips.com/nam/products/fluor/pdf/p-5386a.pdf

[ This Message was edited by: clnfrd on 2003-10-22 03:57 ]
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RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2003 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Fred. I finally saw a picture of an Elwood (8x10) enlarger and it has what looks like a standard aluminum light reflector at the top. The kind very often used with the clamp on work lights. Don't know about the bulb though.

I think there's a lot of options available for the light. The round flourescent might work and would be cheap enough to give a try. I often wonder if those "daylight" bulbs really do give you a daylight temperature. If I had the money, this would be a great excuse to buy an expensive color meter I could go down to a local home store and measure the color of all the lights to find a good one

On the other hand, what temperature light is 'normal' for printing? Back when I did 35mm & 6x6 color, it was with an incandescent bulb. Now they use cold lights...

My old 35mm enlarger uses what we used to call a 'standard enlarger bulb', a regular incandescent light bulb but with no marking on the top of the bulb. Supposedly if you used a reguler household light bulb with the 'GE' (or whatever) marked on top, you'd get a light spot in the middle of the print. I never did try it. But it's a condenser type and that may be true. Does make sense since there's no diffuser.

I hate to admit it now, but a while back I bought several cold light tubes with transformaers. They measure about 5x5 inches and are supposed to be the same as the tubes in the Graflarger. Too large for that, but if two (or 3 or 4) were used, perfect for an 8x10 light source... I haven't had the time to plug them in though. But there's a good chance I already have the bulbs for a cold light head! I got so wrapped up in this discussion that I forgot I had them packed away I also have to look into whether or not a single transformer could power two bulbs or I'd have to use two transformaers? I should look for a neon sign shop...


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Nick



Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2003 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For B&W light colour choice then I think you'll either need to use graded paper. In which case it won't really matter what colour your light is. Assuming it's not red. Second choice would be two bulbs. One green one blue. I think VC cold lights do this now. The third choice would be a lamp producing light ranging from green to blue. You would then use filters to change contrast. If you check the info on the various B&W papers the colour you need should be in there someplace.
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clnfrd



Joined: 26 Mar 2002
Posts: 616
Location: Western Kentucky Lakes Area

PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2003 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

69 (now 70) replies....633 views...is this thread setting some kind of a record?
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RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2003 3:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2003-10-22 15:50, clnfrd wrote:
69 (now 70) replies....633 views...is this thread setting some kind of a record?

I don't think it's a record yet, but we could work on it

Nick: I know the Graflarger light is very green. The only problem is that the eye is far from the best judge of color temperature, especially when dealing with white. I have no idea what color my cold light tubes are but they're supposed to be from some kind of photographic application. Unfortunately, I think I only bought two of them, which is fine because 8x10 is only twice the size of 4x5... Back to light bulbs...


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Graflex Sid



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 221
Location: London,England

PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUT please,please,please Guys,forget it's nuts & bolts,it's viewfinder,it's bellows,and oh,is'nt it nice on the shelf...I want to hear MORE about you are out in the field photographing like mad.

It's shutter blazing away-it's a camera with loads of life in it,it will outlast us all including all the cameras on the market today.

Let's have another section devoted to our photographs taken with this GREAT American camera...life in the old dog yet!

Stop polishing & get motivated,that mean photographing otherwise your shutters are going to stick.

I would to hear more about the great camera in ACTION..


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clnfrd



Joined: 26 Mar 2002
Posts: 616
Location: Western Kentucky Lakes Area

PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2003 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An 8X10 is four times the size of a 4X5. Prove it to yourself...take an 8X10 and see how many 4X5's you can lay on it. Four. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.
Fred.









































































































































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[ This Message was edited by: clnfrd on 2003-10-23 15:48 ]
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Nick



Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2003 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you know the model number of the lamp you might be able to look up the wavelengths it is supposed to put out.
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