Graflex.org Forum Index Graflex.org
Get help with your Graflex questions here
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Compendium lens shades?

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Graflex.org Forum Index -> Large Format Photography
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2003 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had some thoughts about compendium lens shades that I thought might make for a little discussion since it's been a bit quite here lately...
I'll first admit that I don't use either my View or lens shade, or movements as much as I should or I would have run into this a long time ago. This started when I tried fabricating a compendium for my 8x10 B&J...
I got what I thought was a great deal on an old Lindhal compandium setup. All kinds of bell & whistles. I noticed right away that it was designed to be connected to a rail and not the front standard like my View II. I figured out right away that it wouldn't work well. What about rise & fall and shift. The shade doesn't move. Ahh, that's why graflex mounted their shade on the standard. It moves with the lens... So I figured out a way to mount this sahde upside-down on the front standard. It now moves with the lens and all is fine now! But wait a minute. What about tilt and swing? So I checked, and sure enough the shade follows the the lens, but not the film's line of sight. So when you swing or tilt, the shade gets in the way of the view again. Only option is to retract it out of the way or remove it...
I've seen shades mount both ways (rail & standard), but neither works right for all movements.
And all of this just for some comment... Is that why most pros used their hats or hands instead of a shade? Has anyone ever developed a shade mounting that would allow independent shade movement to keep the extension and stay out of the view? Is a compendium really worth the effort?
And yes, this was all prompted by my not being willing to pay the going rate for another compendium for my View II


_________________
----------------------------------------
"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"
----------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Frost



Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Posts: 18
Location: SW Michigan - Fennville

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just got a compendium shade on ebay and await it's arrival to use it. My last recourse was to notice where the sun really botherd my lens. I calculated angle and trajectory of my subject to sunlight glare. Then I planted a tree. My wife ran over it the other day with a mower, and I might have had to wait a few more years to take my picture if it hadn't been for ebay and this compendium comming up being listed in auction. Funny, you can't say Fur Sail in this thread.. LOL

What shades do are minimize the glare from flecks, imperfections in/on the glass. Sometimes, this is quite valuable with earlier lenses in the fact that these lenses were usually single coated, and as opposed to multicoating, had a more difficult time with flare, and light transmission. Simply put is this.. Ever been in an automobile that has been pitted by sand or has some small bugs on it and driving into the sun? Ever notice that as soon as you reach shade of a tree, that the windshield "magically" became clearer? Well, the same effect occurs when you "bathe" the lens in shade when you take a picture. You maximize the potential of the shot/lens combination, and minimize the flare and dirt/surface scratches that are on the lens.

Some people just don't have the patience for a tree to grow up. *S*




_________________
"Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill"

Cheers!
aka vljenewein
Vernon Jenewein
jenefarm@direcway.com

[ This Message was edited by: Frost on 2003-08-01 17:53 ]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2003 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, but I understand the reason for shades or I wouldn't be going through all this. All of my lenses are old and uncoated...
I was just wondering about the mechanics and what other people did since a compendiums seem to have major drawbacks if movements are used. I never thought of planting trees though! Good idea!

And I would guess you're the one who outbid me! I was actually outbid several times over... Since I already have one, I just couldn't bring myself to go that high on a spare. Congrats! They're a bit difficult to come by...


_________________
----------------------------------------
"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"
----------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
jpmose



Joined: 29 May 2001
Posts: 164
Location: Atlanta, GA

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2003 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rich,

I know that the Linhof compendium shade that I own for my Technika not only adjusts in/out but up/down and swing. In otherwords, if you take advantage of lens shift/swing which would project an area of the image circle that may be obstructed by the shade....you can merely twist, shift, compress (whatever you want to call it) the shade to accomodate that area of the image circle.

I also have an original Graflex compendium shade (with red bellows) which allows for some adjustments...not quite as elaborate as the Linhof model.

Like you, I don't use this as much as a should. I do have fixed shades that I tend to use for most work.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2003 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2003-08-04 06:28, jpmose wrote:
Rich,

I know that the Linhof compendium shade that I own for my Technika not only adjusts in/out but up/down and swing. In otherwords, if you take advantage of lens shift/swing which would project an area of the image circle that may be obstructed by the shade....you can merely twist, shift, compress (whatever you want to call it) the shade to accomodate that area of the image circle.

I also have an original Graflex compendium shade (with red bellows) which allows for some adjustments...not quite as elaborate as the Linhof model.

Like you, I don't use this as much as a should. I do have fixed shades that I tend to use for most work.


Ahh, so maybe there is a reason for the super high cost of some of these shades after all?
My Lindahl does adjust, but only a half inch or so to fit different cameras, not movements.

I keep the compendium mounted on my View II, but just don't use the camera as much as I'd like. I've been going over the kit though and have recently added the 75mm lens, so it will hopefully see some more use now.

I have some fixed shades for my Speed also, but usually forget to put them on I have fabricated a 'compendium' for the Speed that works just fine, if I remember to use it...

And I'll also say that direct sunlight is usually not the problem. A hand, hat or dark slide shades that out easily enough. And I suppose no shade would help for backlight situations... I suppose the only real solution would be modern multi-coated lenses, but unfortnately, not for me... And for everything else, there's the compendium, which actually must work pretty well because it's always dark & shady in the camera bag


_________________
----------------------------------------
"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"
----------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
worldphoto



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 199
Location: Southern California

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2003 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Rich
I've been reading your post with much interest. Those shades are attractive, although I went a different way! Because of the many available step-up filters and shades for series filters, I use the series 7,8 or 9 shades with my lenses. The series 9 shade is over 82mm in diameter and over 50mm deep without any step-ups. It works on all my lenses except my 360mm lens.
Harry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2003 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2003-08-04 15:48, worldphoto wrote:
Hi Rich
I've been reading your post with much interest. Those shades are attractive, although I went a different way! Because of the many available step-up filters and shades for series filters, I use the series 7,8 or 9 shades with my lenses. The series 9 shade is over 82mm in diameter and over 50mm deep without any step-ups. It works on all my lenses except my 360mm lens.
Harry


I originally went with the push-on adapters and step rings so I could use screw-in filters & shades. But then I got more lenses, some too large for push-ons, and I didn't keep up with it. And there's the hassle of either finding the right combination, or buying all those pieces for every lens. The setup worked for me, including giving the room to attach the Lee rubber band filter holder (Gel-snap).
I got hooked on compendiums when I bought a GVII that included one. The idea is nice. Plus it's one shade for every lens. Unfortunately, the GVII version doesn't have a filter holder and won't work with the Lee. But after modifying a shade to work with my Speed which included gluing a Lee holder to the shade, I may take the same route with the GVII. Just not using a permanent glue! Long lenses do present problems with them though... Which now makes me relise that I'm going to have to modify my mountings since they won't work with long lenses with a filter installed....
I beginning to think the best solution would be barn doors. They could easily be repositioned to handle any lens and angle of view using movements? I may just switch gears here?


_________________
----------------------------------------
"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"
----------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
worldphoto



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 199
Location: Southern California

PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 4:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The barn door idea sounds real good. My 4x5 and 8x10 views are homemade so I'm free to modify them all I like. Barn doors looks like the only solution for my 360mm lens. It is heavy with a lot of glass hanging out in front. The wind becomes a factor in the field, requiring a strong tripod. The right material is a must. Thin, light, strong, block light, UV resistant, etc.. How to attach them to the camera? Sure a lot of things to think about... Harry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 5:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Too new of a thought to have done any checking yet, but I owuld bet there are barn doors out there already made up that would clamp on. They do make them in all sorts of varieties for studio lights. I have a few here that I haven't seen in years... But I think they're recangular for old electronic flashes? But it sounds like a very workable idea. And they should fold completely flat which would be a much smaller package than any of my compendiums! Although there may be a problem with corner coverage? May not be a perfect idea either?

And you made your own cameras? From scratch? Or something like a Bender? I'd love to make an 8x10 and wanted a Bender, but just don't have the time...


_________________
----------------------------------------
"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"
----------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
worldphoto



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 199
Location: Southern California

PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2003 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An article in the September/October 2000 issue in View Camera magazine is the best answer for me. It is article, How to Make a Darkcloth, by Gordon Hutchings. It shows a picture using a darkslide to support the darkcloth over the lens to make an effective, at no expense, lens shade. It also has another photo showing how the darkcloth can easily shelter the film holders as well as the camera.
Harry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2003 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Covering the whole camera with a dark cloth is always a good idea, depending on the wind... And I could see using it as a shade would be problematic with a breeze too.
But how about a combination? Use the barn doors, which have no corner coverage, covered by a dark cloth?
I wish I had all the issues of View Camera, but I unfortunately only started reading it a couple of years ago...


_________________
----------------------------------------
"Ya just can't have too many GVIIs"
----------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Graflex.org Forum Index -> Large Format Photography All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group