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cmaurice



Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 34
Location: Bay area California

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 2:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have read every post in this section pertaining to what I am looking for. I still can't derive the info I need.
I want to purchase an older flash unit for my Crown. I have a solenoid, and a bipost connector on my lens. What parts (besides the bulbs) do I nedd to get up and running with an older flash. I see units ******* on ...bay and the usual used dealers. I gather that I will need the "proper" sync cord, what about power. And what else would be needed?
I have a source locally for a very inexpensive Heiland, what do I look for to ensure compatibility? Lotsa questions.....
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vic valis



Joined: 21 Nov 2001
Posts: 247
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take a deep breathe... this is a long one. Hopefully it won't be too confusing. To a really big degree, you can mix and match. Okay, here's a few things to look out for: first, what sort of solenoid is it you have? Graflex solenoids are usually chromed, with a female bipost connection at the bottom, and will have engraved words to the effect "Graflex #3." What this means is that the solenoid is made to be used with a 3-cell flash. If it is a Heiland, it will have a "HR" on the side. These solenoids have a male bipost conection, but beware: the male biposts on these solenoids are thicker than male bipost connections you will see on other flash equipment. That is, a flash cord with a standard femail bipost connection will not fit the Heiland solenoid.
You can still mix products, just have to be careful. For example, I have a very old Heiland Flash gun with three household connections. Any flash cord with a standard male HH connection will fit this flash gun. I can connect this flash via the cord to any Graflex solenoid so long as the cord has a male bipost connecton on the other end. Or to a Heiland solenoid wo long as the cord has a Heiland female connectin on the other end.
Of the two Heiland flashes I have, the earlier one only has HH connections. The later model has both HH and one female bipost connection. The Graflex flash has 3 male bipost connections (one under the red button) and one HH. The Graflite has only HH connections. The most versatile of these is the Graflite, probably the least expensive and most plentiful as well. There are other models as well of which I know little to nothing.
So much for the solenoid-to-flash gun part. The flash gun can be used to trip the shutter (front shutter, not the focal plane shutter, which should be open when using the front shutter... will let someone else discus the focal plane shutter) via the solenoid. Or you can use the shutter to trip the flash, if the shutter has a flash sync. Modern shutters have what is called a PC connection. Older shutters have male bipost connections. You can connect a shutter to, let's say, a Graflex flash using a cord with a bipost connection on the shutter end and either a female bipost or HH connection on the other. Mechanical conections exist too... Kalart made a synchronizer that was a cable release with built-in male bipost connection that could be plugged into Kalart flashes. Push the cable release, and it would trip the shutter and set off the flash at the same time (although I doesnt work too well with the focal plane shutter; too much mechanical play).
So the things to look out for is to make sure you have the proper cord with the proper connections. With the exception of the female Heiland bipost connection, you can buy almost anny combination from Paramount cords. Or you can find them on ebay with enough patience. The important thing, if you think you'll eventually use this equipment a lot, is to have replacement cords. Very important, and almost any photographer worth his salt will tell you to have lots of extras, bscause cords are easily lost or easily twisted, resulting in broken connections... and it always happens when you need the cord most.
Final note: this is my understand of how things works. You cnnot discount the possibility that I'm entirely full of crap. If so, others will correct me, and I look forward to it because I want to make sure I've got it right myself. Good luck.

jeff

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cmaurice



Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 34
Location: Bay area California

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the help, Vic. I know that once I have the pieces in hand that the whole thing becomes much clearer.

Ok,
I have a heiland solenoid with a bipost male connector. My shutter is a graphic with a bipost connector. I am watching a Kalart speed flash /w automatic synchronizer on E..y. I gather from your post that I can connect this baby 2 ways. To my solenoid, and to the shutter sync?
The household plug is a mystery(does the flash plug into a wall socket for power, or is the connector just in that shape that it would appear to?)
My camera is a Crown, no focal plane shutter. Once I get a flash, I will need 2 cords, 1 to connect to the solenoid, and one for the shutter sync? I have read about these power cells etc, but will the flash run on the c or d cell batteries in the wand.

I don't know why I am going to all this trouble. I have a Vivitar 283 and a Paramount custom cord. .I'm just hardheaded, love old stuff, and recently discovered that flashbulbs are relatively plentiful and inexpensive.

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jdman



Joined: 13 May 2001
Posts: 302
Location: Midwest

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since you have a Crown I would buy a Graflite flash. because of the options on this unit you can use syncronized flash and fire the solenoid to trip the shutter. A lot of other flash tubes donot have this capability. Also you must have a Heiland solenoid cord not a Bi-post to connect to the solenoid. This was noted in Vics reply. As far as the House type plug this has nothing to do with 115 volt use and do not plug it in to a 115 outlet. The Graflite uses 3 D cells and has plenty of power for both the flash and solenoid. You may be able to use the 283 strobe if the shutter you have has X sync, or is a flash supermatic and you do not set the delay. Russ
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cmaurice



Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 34
Location: Bay area California

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shoot, just when I'm learning something new...
My crown shutter has no "x" setting. I purchased the 283 and the paramount bipost to vivitar, and now I can't use it?
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cmaurice



Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 34
Location: Bay area California

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oops shutter is a Supermatic (x)..
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45PSS



Joined: 28 Sep 2001
Posts: 3246
Location: Mid Peninsula, Ca.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vic was incorrect when he stated that the number on the selonids (grafphic) were the number of cells that they were designed to work with. According to Graphic Selonid manual a #2 was for a 2x3 camera, a #3 was for a 3x4 camera, and a #0 was for a 4x5 camera. any of the selonids will work with any of the flash units and will, with proper bracket, fit any camera.
With selonid mounted, adjusted (see http://graflex.org/helpboard/viewtopic.php?topic=1453&forum=7&4) and connected to the flash Selonid outlet, pressing the flash button fires the bulb, and the shutter is opened by the selonid when the bulb has reached its peak. (remote firing)
With shutter sync contacts connected to the flash Shutter contacts and shutter sync set to the proper bulb sync, triping the shutter via its trip lever fires the flash bulb via the shutter's contacts. If the shutter has X sync only then the shutter will be nearly closed before the bulb reaches its peak. Use selonid (remote) firing only with shutters that have x sync.
I believe this to be applicable to Heland, Graflex, Graflite, King Sol, and any other brand of flash.
Charles

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[ This Message was edited by: 45PSS on 2003-04-02 22:49 ]
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vic valis



Joined: 21 Nov 2001
Posts: 247
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with the suggestion that with a Crown you'll want a Graflite flash... I'm watching a few Kalart flashes and neither looks like they would attach to your camera: one threads to the camera same way as a tripod, the other looks like it needs a specific bracket to attach to. Look for a Graflite with Graflex clamps. The clamps should attach to either your camera's strap handle or to an accessory bracket that may already be attached to the camera. Go to ebay and look at Item # 2920239889 for an example of the two clamps and the bracket. I'm selling those items but DON'T bid on the set; you might not need the bracket, and as often as not you'll find the flash with the clamps alredy attached. Save yourself the money. And NOTE: the household connection we mention is a refernece to the SIZE and SHAPE of the connection... do NOT try and plug any of this stuff into the wall socket. That is, the sync cord HH connection is the same size as an appliance cord's. I once came across a flash cord that had had a Heiland female connector spliced ontoan appliance cord.

Wow, listen to me... you'd think I know what I'm talking about.

jeff

_________________
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I'll not deny.
I heard it once;
It said "good-bye."
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sobahguy



Joined: 09 Oct 2001
Posts: 171
Location: Massachusetts

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I concur with all other suggestions that you would do best with a Graflite battery case/handle catalog #2773 with 5" and/or 7" reflector (depending on the type of bulbs you have access to) As suggested, they are are plentiful enough, much more versatile and less expensive than the earlier chrome version. Try to find one with the clamps already attached, as Jeff pointed out. The Graflite is also the most popular out there (IMHO) and is a "historically accurate" match for the Crown Graphic, both having been introduced right around 1947, that is if having a "period correct" flash is something you wish to have, as I do. A proper sync cord for a Heiland solenoid will be harder to find, but if you are patient I have seen them appear on "E" auction site from time to time, or you could try calling Stephen Shuart http://www.stephenshuart.com

Another possibility is here:
http://www.pacificrimcamera.com/catalog/ej11.htm
Scroll down & there are several different Heiland cords listed, best to perhaps give them a call.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

[ This Message was edited by: sobahguy on 2003-04-03 04:57 ]
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