Graflex.org Forum Index Graflex.org
Get help with your Graflex questions here
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Speed Graphic Sync Speed

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Graflex.org Forum Index -> Speed Graphic Help
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
sector



Joined: 06 Mar 2002
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm trying to find out a few things about speed graphic sync speeds. I'm looking to use a Graflex to take some high speed sports photos (just for curiosity sake)
I want to use several off camera flashes and would like any input this group can offer as to which camera i should look into.
Check out http://www.ryanallan.com for photo examples of what I do.

Thanks in advance
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Dan Fromm



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 1883
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2002-03-06 23:39, sector wrote:
I'm trying to find out a few things about speed graphic sync speeds. I'm looking to use a Graflex to take some high speed sports photos (just for curiosity sake)
I want to use several off camera flashes and would like any input this group can offer as to which camera i should look into.
Check out http://www.ryanallan.com for photo examples of what I do.

Thanks in advance
The leaf shutters used on Graphics will sync flash at all speeds. Pacemaker Speed Graphics' focal plane shutters don't sync with flash at all.

Dan
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
alecj



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 853
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Uh Dan, he didn't absolutely say "electronic flash", although that's what I'd guess he meant too. But the Graphics WILL sync the fp shutter with flashbulbs, and there were some flashbulbs that would sync at very high speeds.

Don't write those old guys off so quick!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sector



Joined: 06 Mar 2002
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm looking into the Super Speed Graphic - The 1/1000 flash sync is what I'm looking for. I will be using electronic flashes. (sorry old guys) Any other advice before I got all out and get one of these setups?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's one of the dilemas you will have to work out. When you increase the shutter speed you will loose a certain amount of light from your strobes.

As you increase the power to the strobe you will increase it's duration which will be cut off by the shutter.

Fast strobe times are usually found in the lower half of a strobes variable power curve.

So either expect to shoot with shallow fstops of 5.6 or f8 or expect to spend some capital for lots of black line speedo trons so you can have lots of light for a short duration.

The way they did this in the past was with type SM gas filed bulbs. These didn't have the output of a typical bulb but the duration was short and still considerably more than say a 283 Vivitar.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2002-03-07 10:41, sector wrote:
...
(sorry old guys)


Huh!!! Hey, I resemble that remark!
Back in my days... We would count on the fast electronic flash to make up for a slow shutter speed. So, taking Les' comments into account, you might as well settle for a slower shutter speed and accept the reletively short (at least 1/1000 sec at full power) burst from the flash to do your work...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
sector



Joined: 06 Mar 2002
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am able to achieve f5.6 - f8 at 1/2 to quarter power with my current flashes(very close to subject). 1 Quantum Q flash - 2 Sunpak 555

I want the 1000 for rich blue skies with frozen action and 4X5 transperancies.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
sector



Joined: 06 Mar 2002
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skys
i dont much like skiing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Dan Fromm



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 1883
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2002-03-07 10:55, Les wrote:
Here's one of the dilemas you will have to work out. When you increase the shutter speed you will loose a certain amount of light from your strobes.

As you increase the power to the strobe you will increase it's duration which will be cut off by the shutter.

Fast strobe times are usually found in the lower half of a strobes variable power curve.

So either expect to shoot with shallow fstops of 5.6 or f8 or expect to spend some capital for lots of black line speedo trons so you can have lots of light for a short duration.

The way they did this in the past was with type SM gas filed bulbs. These didn't have the output of a typical bulb but the duration was short and still considerably more than say a 283 Vivitar.


Uh, Les, you've lost me completely. What kind of flashes are you talking about?

Cheers,

Dan
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dan Fromm



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 1883
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

On 2002-03-07 11:12, sector wrote:
I am able to achieve f5.6 - f8 at 1/2 to quarter power with my current flashes(very close to subject). 1 Quantum Q flash - 2 Sunpak 555

I want the 1000 for rich blue skies with frozen action and 4X5 transperancies.




Um, Sector, I fear me that you can't have it all. If you want enough exposure from the flash to stop motion, you're going to have to pick shutter speed and aperture to put ambient at least two, preferably three or more, steps down from the flash. Otherwise you'll get ghosting from the ambient. Y'just can't win, sorry.

Cheers, also regrets,

Dan
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sector



Joined: 06 Mar 2002
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUT I WANT IT!!!

Ha - Thanks for all the help everybody. I will let you all know how this experiment goes if I try it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
extraparts



Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 59
Location: texas

PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2002 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are going to go out and buy a Super Speed 1/1000 shutter, I suggest that you look for the ones with one of the shutter blades with about an 1/8 of an inch of the leading edge bent up. These are reported to the the later models and are supposed to be more reliable. I have seen several of the older designs where several of the blades tried to occupy the same place at the same time. Not pretty.

Neal

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Les



Joined: 09 May 2001
Posts: 2682
Location: Detroit, MI

PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2002 12:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is what you are up against.
If you want blue skies and flash you'll need to shoot at dusk or dawn. You'll need either lots of black line speedotrons with 4 heads at half or less power, or a Sinarbron Grafit which really did have a full power 1/1000th flash duration and was capable of freezing a bicycle wheel at f22 @ 10ft, but if you don't have a sinar rep handy it will cost more than a bundle. Elinchrome might have something similar.

without a Sinar flash or something equivilent, you'll be shooting with a coated tessar nearly wide open.

Also, since the Optar lens is a 135mm your depth of field for a given f stop will be about half or less than a 50mm lens .

I think it will be obvious that a ten year old multi-coated Nikkor at f8 will beat the pants off a 50 year old tessar at f4.5.

If this were 1957 and I had this assignment at Life, I might get it done with Super Speed and flash bulbs , or a trip to see Harold Eggerton at MIT might get me the right gear, but I'd be angling to borrow Eisie's Leica.

Ignoring the emotional aspect of shooting with a super speed, I think the best way to get a nice big chrome is to shoot Provia and make friends with the local graphics house. they could make knockout 8x10s.
And for the $600+ for the Super Speed plus the flash equipment, you could make a lot of scanned dupe transparencies.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Graflex.org Forum Index -> Speed Graphic Help All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group