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rb auto shutter questions

 
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superD



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 3
Location: california

PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2006 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, I'm new to the forum...my rb auto graflex was working, but I fiddled with the shutter tension adjustment and now it's 'gone limp', and I'm not sure if I messed up the spring, or if it just needs the proper tensioning...can anyone point me towards information on the proper adjustment of the graflex shutter? Thank you!


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45PSS



Joined: 28 Sep 2001
Posts: 3202
Location: Mid Peninsula, Ca.

PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2006 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please explain "fiddled".

Refer to the RB manual posted on this site.
SET tension to 1 and curtain to O (open).
On plate with tensioning knob "B", remove the cover nut on the lower left and put a small slot screwdriver into the end of the tension roller and hold. Remove the four screws holding the plate to the body. Without removing or letting go of the screwdriver in the tension roller, pull the plate back so that the gears of the wind knob and tension roller disenguage. Turn screwdriver on tension roller counterclockwise five turns and reattach plate with tension knob at 1 and gears meshing and secure with two screws in opposite corners. Trip shutter-curtain should fully close and latch firmly. If it does not then add more tension as described. When near correct movement is achieved decrease the number of turns on the roller screwdriver. If no tension can be achieved the spring has most likely broken. From a no tension state to some detectable tension is approximately 25 to 30 turns on the screwdriver.

Does this correct your fiddling?????????????

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superD



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 3
Location: california

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Hi, many thanks for the detailed instructions!

After setting the curtain to "0" and tension knob to 1, I held the screwdriver in place on the screw and then tightened counterclock wise five turns. The curtain moved just a bit when I released the shutter, and I repeated this several times with the same result, so I am forced to conclude that the spring is indeed broken. Does anyone on the forum know of a repair service!

[ By "fiddling", I meant that I attempted to adjust the tension per someone else's instructions, and let the tension roller screwhead get away from me, rapidly releasing all the tension...I suspect this let to the spring becoming useless!...] thanks again, for the excellent instructions@
On 2006-05-06 23:08, 45PSS wrote:
Please explain "fiddled".

Refer to the RB manual posted on this site.
SET tension to 1 and curtain to O (open).
On plate with tensioning knob "B", remove the cover nut on the lower left and put a small slot screwdriver into the end of the tension roller and hold. Remove the four screws holding the plate to the body. Without removing or letting go of the screwdriver in the tension roller, pull the plate back so that the gears of the wind knob and tension roller disenguage. Turn screwdriver on tension roller counterclockwise five turns and reattach plate with tension knob at 1 and gears meshing and secure with two screws in opposite corners. Trip shutter-curtain should fully close and latch firmly. If it does not then add more tension as described. When near correct movement is achieved decrease the number of turns on the roller screwdriver. If no tension can be achieved the spring has most likely broken. From a no tension state to some detectable tension is approximately 25 to 30 turns on the screwdriver.

Does this correct your fiddling?????????????

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45PSS



Joined: 28 Sep 2001
Posts: 3202
Location: Mid Peninsula, Ca.

PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2006 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Hi, many thanks for the detailed instructions!

After setting the curtain to "0" and tension knob to 1, I held the screwdriver in place on the screw and then tightened counterclock wise five turns. The curtain moved just a bit when I released the shutter, and I repeated this several times with the same result, so I am forced to conclude that the spring is indeed broken. Does anyone on the forum know of a repair service!

[ By "fiddling", I meant that I attempted to adjust the tension per someone else's instructions, and let the tension roller screwhead get away from me, rapidly releasing all the tension...I suspect this let to the spring becoming useless!...] thanks again, for the excellent instructions@


If you have not done so, keep trying to increase tension. As long as you are able to detect an increase of tension on the screwdriver on the tension spring then the spring is good. The way you faddled, the spring may have reverse wound and require a lot more turns to get the proper tension.

Click on and read the BBcode link (available when posting) also.

Charles

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[ This Message was edited by: 45PSS on 2006-05-15 18:07 ]
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bertsaunders



Joined: 20 May 2001
Posts: 577
Location: Bakersfield California

PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2006 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not a good idea to keep turning the adjustment screw to add tension...if you have to turn (from scratch) more than about 20 revolutions, you stand a good chance of making the spring absolutely useless! If the spring has doubled over itself, it will never give the proper speeds again, you must then consider buying a very expensive spring from Fred Lustig! Sorry Charles, dont mean to dissagree, but what you suggest here, is not a good idea!
Have a nice day....Bert
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45PSS



Joined: 28 Sep 2001
Posts: 3202
Location: Mid Peninsula, Ca.

PostPosted: Wed May 17, 2006 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So if something is totaled nothing can be lost from experminting and some usefullness may be gained, just don't use a hammer and punch to do it.

superD,
bert gave me those adjustment instructions once upon a time when i did not know.
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Graflex Corp.was a (silent) supporter of Rain Forest Devastation.

[ This Message was edited by: 45PSS on 2006-05-16 22:24 ]
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superD



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 3
Location: california

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2006 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Thanks to all for the replies; Bert is helping me with my shutter at this point ...guess the moral is, don't go beyond what you know how to do...I allowed the shutter tension to 'slip', and in a moment I was in trouble!
On 2006-05-16 22:21, 45PSS wrote:
So if something is totaled nothing can be lost from experminting and some usefullness may be gained, just don't use a hammer and punch to do it.

superD,
bert gave me those adjustment instructions once upon a time when i did not know.
________________
Graflex Corp.was a (silent) supporter of Rain Forest Devastation.

[ This Message was edited by: 45PSS on 2006-05-16 22:24 ]
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45PSS



Joined: 28 Sep 2001
Posts: 3202
Location: Mid Peninsula, Ca.

PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2006 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep praticing the "quote".

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semihemi



Joined: 25 Oct 2003
Posts: 85
Location: Boston, MA

PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Bert - Don't know if I mentioned this previously but I got the shutter on my 5x7 Press so well lubed that when I actually set it up and shot a picture, the dang curtain took off so fast that it just kept on going and came right off the roller. It sounded like the world's largest window shade spring uncoiling. Does this mean spring has doubled over itself? How can I tell?

PS: Yes this is the same 5x7 from years ago. Still yet to take an image in my hands! I may have to call in the pros!!
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bertsaunders



Joined: 20 May 2001
Posts: 577
Location: Bakersfield California

PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Semi,
No this means that "the curtain came off the roller", or broke the side straps at one of the slots! To good a lube job did not cause the problem either! (Not likely!)
Determine if the curtain straps broke, or the curtain just came off of the roller, and before changing anything check to see what the tension was set at! I recommend that the hi tensions >>not be used<< above >3<, on these old, 35 to 80 year old and older curtains(most models tension 3 would be around 550 shutter speed)....in most cases (not all fast emulsions are avail for the larger sizes) modern fast emulsion speeds can compensate for the fast shutter speeds!
If the straps broke, cut strips of bellows material (Micro Tools cat #SCM-2)(for most models) 3/8" wide and at least 1" longer than the slot...match the existing!
use rubber cement like contact cement....a thin coat on the curtain and on the new strap material, let it sit until dull, carefully align and press into place! You will be supprised at your new >contact cement< so treat it as such, it will stick whereever you make contact...but...>>get it wrong<< and you can try it again...if you are carefull, it will come off again! remove old glue by rubbing it off with your finger..re-apply glue as before and this time...get it on straight!
I use the Rubber glue to re-attach the cloth to the roller too, do not clean the old glue off of the roller, makes a good contact for the new glue....you will be able to see where the cloth was attached originally, so stay within those limits, and paint the glue on the roller and on the cloth in strips about 1/4" wide and 1/4" apart (end to end) of the roller, do not lose patience, let it dry before trying to make contact...and set it on center and straight on the roller!
Of coarse to do either repair, you will have to remove the back, I use a thin sheet of plywood under the curtain, and a wedge to hold the curtain from rolling for the strap repair, and usually have to remove the roller to re-attach the curtain!
I have the instructions for re-setting the tension, about the only thing that I have changed on my instructions is an easier way to count the turns....instead of turning the shaft with the screwdriver, I now rotate the entire tension plate! (Think 45pss mentioned that I had given him the instructions a while back, (get the new instructions 45))
BSAUNDERS1@BAK.RR.COM
USE SMALL CASE of coarse!
Have a nice day......Bert




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