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Anyone Using M2 or AG1 Bulbs?

 
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Dober



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 4
Location: Southeast US

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a question about the different classes of bulbs available. I have started using #5 bulbs with my graflite flash unit, but was wondering if it is possible to use the Class MF bulbs like the M2 or AG1 bulbs. I can't really find any techincal data that explains the difference between Class M and MF bulbs.

Does anyone know the differences between these two classes? Has anyone tried using the M2 or AG1 bulbs in a 5-inch reflecter? Will they synch properly with a between the lens shutter with an M synch setting?

Thanks for any comments or info you can share.
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glennfromwy



Joined: 29 Nov 2001
Posts: 903
Location: S.W. Wyoming

PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think they would sync better with the "F" setting if your shutter has it. These are pretty fast bulbs. I haven't used the M2 bulbs but my M3s state that they will synch with just about anything (in so many words). Why don't you just try them? They are still readily available on eBay. They go cheap because they're just not very highly sought after. I will get back with more info on them.

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Glenn

"Wyoming - Where everybody is somebody else's weirdo"
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Gammanine



Joined: 11 Aug 2001
Posts: 46
Location: Brooklyn NY

PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I remember, ag1 and m2's are x sync. I've used m2's and m3's in the 5 inch polished reflector on a 2773. I was never happy with them, and have since moved on to the M25 when I want to use a smaller bulb. I don't have experience with the AG bulbs.
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glennfromwy



Joined: 29 Nov 2001
Posts: 903
Location: S.W. Wyoming

PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What information I have says they will work at any sync setting with a shutter speed of 1/30 or less. They will even sync with 35mm focal plane shutters at slower speeds.

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Glenn

"Wyoming - Where everybody is somebody else's weirdo"
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Top



Joined: 06 Apr 2002
Posts: 198
Location: Northern New England USA

PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A proper reflector helps a lot. While I have many adapters to use bayonet base, button base, and Ag-1s in the big Heiland flashguns, the one I use the most has it's own 3" reflector built in. Pops right into a right-angle Heiland or Graflite head. Looks kinda strange, but wotks fine with the little bulbs.
Try x-synch at about 1/50, and hold steady!
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RichS



Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 1467
Location: South of Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, sometimes I just don't pay attention

Do AG1'a really X-synch? It's the first I've heard of that, that I can remember now anyway...

And someone made adapters to use the tiny AG1's in the big flash holders? Never saw one of those either. But if they really existed, and they X-synch, I gotta do some looking!
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glennfromwy



Joined: 29 Nov 2001
Posts: 903
Location: S.W. Wyoming

PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2004 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have adapters to use AG-1 bulbs in bayonet sockets. Got 'em on ebay a couple of years ago. The guy had a whole box full, so I bought 5 or 6 at something like a buck apiece, new.

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Glenn

"Wyoming - Where everybody is somebody else's weirdo"
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Top



Joined: 06 Apr 2002
Posts: 198
Location: Northern New England USA

PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2004 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

have adapters to use AG-1 bulbs in bayonet sockets. Got 'em on ebay a couple of years ago. The guy had a whole box full, so I bought 5 or 6 at something like a buck apiece, new.
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Glenn

Same rig I have. You stack the AG-1-to- bayonet into the bayonet-to-screw adapter.
But the little adapter with the built-in reflector works better.
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Press25



Joined: 28 May 2003
Posts: 13
Location: Minneapolis,MN

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find that M-2's are a good choice if you are using faster films, are able to use a shutter speed of 1\30 or less, and the subject isn't moving much. Plus, you don't blind your subjects like a #5 or a M-3 as much! As the others have said, you can only go up to 1\50 (X sync)with this bulb but think 1\30 or less for full output.
I only have one bayonet to AG1 adapter. I don't think that the are that popular. I haven't tried it in any of my Graflex flashes either. If I had more I would probably use this bulb more often and save my other ring clip and bayonet bulbs for other jobs. Once my stash of ring clip bulbs goes I probably will have to go to the AG bulbs!
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glennfromwy



Joined: 29 Nov 2001
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Location: S.W. Wyoming

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thought on using the AG-1 bulbs. They were made to use in wee little reflectors, such as the one Top described (3"). If you are going to use them in a 5" reflector, you need to give a bit more exposure, say one stop.

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Glenn

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Dober



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 4
Location: Southeast US

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone, thanks for the responses! It sounds like I should maybe think about using the AG1 bulbs rather than the M2. I need faster shutter speeds than 1/30 sec., and if I understand the guide number data correctly on Bill Cress' site, it looks like the AG1 will synch at all speeds with the M synch. Let me know if this is not correct.

Thanks again!
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Jim23



Joined: 08 Sep 2001
Posts: 128
Location: US/Greater Cincinnati, Ohio

PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2005 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

M2's work great with the Graphex M-F-X shutter and provide full light output at 1/100 sec. (with the Graphex RED M-sync setting only) due to a very unique feature of the Graphex shutter. I have tested this with Poloroid film! Thus, if you have a GRAPHEX shutter and lots of M2 lamps, you have a very useful combination. Thus, only the M2 subclass of lamps will work in this fashion due to their somewhat quicker peak (13-15ms)than the true M-type lamps (#5, 25, 22, M3, AG1, etc. at 19-20 ms - which normal M-sync applies). This only applies to the GRAPHEX shutter since it has a unique dual-adjustable-delay M-sync (RED/BLACK).

According to the Morgan & Morgan 1958 'Graphic-Graflex Photography' book, page 19, chapter "Flash Syncronization and Shutters" since the Graphex shutter has TWO M-sync settings. The BLACK M-setting yields the typical M setting delay of 19 ms. The RED M-setting yields a delay of 9-10ms. Hence, according to the book, "With [Typical M2] Lamps having a delay of 13-15ms it will be seen that and exposure of 1/100 will easily catch the entire useful output of the lamp, and at the same time will permit some action stopping on the part of the shutter."

In summary, M2 lamps, with the right reflector and a Graphex shutter are a good combination. Often, M2's are found for much less cost than M3's. Note that the output is still less than an M3 or larger true M-sync lamp; however, the M2 can be used at a reasonable shutter speed.
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Polaski



Joined: 06 Jun 2005
Posts: 21
Location: Philadelphia, PA

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cress Photo has AG1 to bayonette adapters for $12 or so.
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